captain sullenberger, did you want to add a comment to that? >> i certainly do. sms and fatigue risk management systems are important, but they're additional safeguards. what we need to do is close the loophole, solve the problem, insure that cargo carriers have to build schedules that comply with federal aviation regulation, which is fatigue rule that the passenger airlines have to comply with, and not try to fix it later with quite frankly a band-aid approach. we need to solve the problem. fatigue is futeal, whether you're carrying passengers or packages. >> and maintenance. >> and maintenance. >> thank you. >> thank you i would like to call on senator peters. >> thank you madam chair and thank you, member cantwell for holding the hearing and certainly it's been a fascinating hearing and i enjoy the conversation from the panelists. there's been quite a bit of discussion on the required hours and pilot experience prior to being a co-pilot. i wanted to explore that a little further if i may. ms. black, you talked about the pay structure of regional airlines in th